moonchain
Guide
It raises a fever of intense apathy.
Posts: 595
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Post by moonchain on Nov 24, 2005 22:10:28 GMT -5
cenk: Other Aryans? hmm... maybe not.
You forgot South Americans, Indians and any indigenous persons on an island ever or currently occupied by Europeans or Americans.
Tara: I'm also wondering if your dad was making a statement about land theft in general or even the immigration of many people who were so poor that they had to steal to eat and made their way to America so they wouldn't have to.
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Post by Tara on Nov 25, 2005 16:12:43 GMT -5
Steal... and kill the natives too? We just had Thanksgiving yesterday in the U.S. The way my dad described that day was that, we are all celebrating how the Europeans stole the land from the natives and say, "Let's eat," lol #sigh# I always think about that every time Thanksgiving rolls around. Every time.
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Post by Mestemia on Nov 25, 2005 17:20:48 GMT -5
Common sense, though, says that "normal" people would not, in general, leave a comfortable home for the less-than-hospitable environment that the emerging "New World" offered. So it's a pretty safe bet that a lot of these were folks had a reason to escape the "Old World"... whether it be escaping persecution (due to status or religion) or fear of prosecution... Of course, there were some just looking for adventure, I'm sure. I think a great many came just hoping to become rich. Land was scarce in Europe, obtained only by inheritance. The New World offered the opportunity to eventually become landowners to folks who never had a hope of that before. Those willing to brave the elements and the natives probably saw it as the opportunity of a lifetime. How about: The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. Like the mice sing in the movie "An American Tale": There are no cats in america and the streets are paved in cheese.
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Post by Mestemia on Nov 25, 2005 17:22:08 GMT -5
I remember seeing a show called "hysteria" where they presented american history from the Native American point of view.
Very enlightening.
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Post by Tara on Nov 25, 2005 17:44:41 GMT -5
Sounds very interesting. It's something I would definately watch. For one, I would want to see how these people view the views of the Native Americans.
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moonchain
Guide
It raises a fever of intense apathy.
Posts: 595
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Post by moonchain on Nov 25, 2005 17:59:29 GMT -5
Polytheist: Ha! You mean Histeria!, the kids show? I used to love that! One of the most interesting T.V. moments for me happened on that show - I saw one episode where they had Alexander the Great (portrayed as white w/blonde hair) and then in another episode they re-aired that segment with a prologue from Father Time about Alexander not being white and apologizing. Oh the P.C.-ness.
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Post by Tara on Nov 26, 2005 9:30:58 GMT -5
Huh?
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Post by cenk on Nov 26, 2005 11:27:18 GMT -5
The Aryans have not caused complete destruction in Asia. Although Vietnam, Korea and the Opium Wars were pretty horrific.
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moonchain
Guide
It raises a fever of intense apathy.
Posts: 595
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Post by moonchain on Nov 26, 2005 13:20:38 GMT -5
Tara: Politically Correct-ness.
cenk: I was thinking of India, when the Brits occupied that country for so long, without regards to the people who actually lived there.
Reminds me of Eddie Izzard: We stole countries with the cunning use of flags. Just sail around the world and stick a flag in. "I claim India for Britain!" And they're going "You can't claim us, we live here! Five hundred million of us!" "Do you have a flag?"
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Post by cenk on Nov 26, 2005 14:29:36 GMT -5
Oh yes how could I forget that.
I have arrived at the conclusion that the Aryans/Caucasians - basically the White man are the most evil and genocidal people that live on this Earth.
No offensive meant to anyone.
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moonchain
Guide
It raises a fever of intense apathy.
Posts: 595
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Post by moonchain on Nov 26, 2005 16:20:42 GMT -5
I don't take offense, but I don't think it's so much "evil" as just plain stupid. Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups. For a long time, we were the uneducated masses pretending to be the educated, merely because a handful of us were able to come up with better technology for a period of time.
::moonchain realizes she's about as Aryan as you can be - English-German-Welsh-Danish::
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Post by cenk on Nov 26, 2005 18:37:32 GMT -5
I don't take offense, but I don't think it's so much "evil" as just plain stupid. Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups. Well some of these "stupid" people are still glorified. (Genocide by Americans in Korea and Vietnam and the British Empires rape of about a quarter to a third of the world) Some could see it as the Aryans had the technology but they used it for bad. Moonchain is told no, she is more Aryan than me. My "ethnicity" is part Turkish part Turkish Cypriot... a very brief summary is that the Turks (oh god I hope you've heard of Turkey or a Turk) didn't originate in the place today called Turkey, we were nomads from Central Asia we looked Oriental not too Oriental like the Chinese but still. About a thousand years ago we migrated to Turkey but we weren't the majority of the population, Turkey at that time was a hotbed of different peoples so the vast majority of the Turks just got absorbed with the different peoples...theres a few pieces of info that I dont want to talk about (its to do with Genocide)........but today when I look in the mirror I see someone whos dark white. I look like a stranger compared to my brothers in Central Asia and Siberia. I guess the point is that I could be part Aryan (I hope not), I could be part Jewish, I could be part European(actually I think its most likely that I am), I could be part middle Eastern, I could be part pretty much anything. Fortunately I have some physical marks that are passed on so I am able to establish that I had ancestors in Central Asia. I just would like to know what exactly am I. I dont mean to be rude and stuff its just it makes me so angry that "White man" has commited so many crimes against humainity against Black, Oriental and even themselves. I think what the Native Americans suffered was the worst unpunished crime ever.
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moonchain
Guide
It raises a fever of intense apathy.
Posts: 595
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Post by moonchain on Nov 26, 2005 20:55:04 GMT -5
As an American, I have no love for what we have done in Vietnam or what we did to the Native Americans. In fact, most people (read: Americans, including Aryan Americans) really don't. In the case of Vietnam, it was a vocal minority that wanted us to get involved in that idiocy. Same as with Iraq. Some people glorify it, but that's because we have a large group that gets all gung-ho about "improving" the world while ignoring our own problems and this group no longer is exclusive to Aryans. And there is really no telling that had these so-called Aryans* not had the technology and self-developed power whether another group may have done the same to the world. The White Man had the power and used it in a corrupt manner. Other groups have done the same on basis of race or religion when they were able to create power. Power corrupts. It's just a fact. That doesn't make all Whites evil. *I say so-called Aryan because, and as you seem to also assert with your "I could be part European" statement, a lot of people don't realize that although the Indo-Aryans swarmed through mainly northern Europe, there is not much that separates them from the rest of Europe anymore, as this article indicates. A more interesting note on that article is that it was actually written by one who is a "racialist." I'm not one, nor do I have any connection to those who promote "racial purity" (as I indicated in the 'hate music in America' thread), but I find it fascinating that those who are still trying are divided about what Aryanism means. Also, when I said "as Aryan as you can be" that was not "you" as in "cenk", but "you" as in "anybody who can claim to be Aryan." And yes, I know who the Turks are.
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Post by littlepea on Nov 27, 2005 14:45:11 GMT -5
I have arrived at the conclusion that the Aryans/Caucasians - basically the White man are the most evil and genocidal people that live on this Earth. No offensive meant to anyone. unlike moonchain, i do take offense, because you are being outrageously racist, not to mention boring. i don't take offense simply because i am aryan and i am one of the least violent people i know, i take offense because i am aryan and that is the most sweeping and unfair generalization i've heard for quite some time (and i can't believe people on here aren't slating you for it). i realize that the brits have committed some terrible atrocities throughout history including genocide and several other attempted genocides (including the highland scots, though you seem reluctant to accept this) - and then there's the conduct of other europeans in south america and africa etc. but does that really mean that aryans are naturally more violent than other races? if it does then you must assume that all other races are less intelligent than aryans because they didn't manage to organise themselves as efficiently, and become more sophisticated and educated and invent efficient and sophisticated weapons like the white europeans did so they could defend themselves. surely you are not suggesting anything of this sort? as part of an ethnic minority, surely it would be in your interests to promote the fact that we are all equal rather than we are all different, in case i turn round and say, "you know what, cenk? you might have a point there - i've been suppressing this urge to kick you in the teeth since i first met you, it must be because i'm aryan, a fact which i can't help, so i guess there's no point in suppressing it any longer ... " honestly, cenk, you are a fĂșcking fool.
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Post by Sue on Nov 27, 2005 15:07:46 GMT -5
littlepea: I couldn't agree more.
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