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Post by Tara on Sept 16, 2005 7:18:39 GMT -5
I remember a long time ago my dad told me that America was a country started by a bunch of crooks. Something about the western Europeans shipping a lot of their jailbirds over when the "new country" was started. Then the other day someone mentioned the same exact thing to me but I haven't had the chance to look things up. Both of them claim that this is why we have so many corporate thugs. What do you think of such a claim? Is it nonesense or does it deserve some merit?
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Post by dianaholberg on Sept 16, 2005 7:31:36 GMT -5
I don't know if it has merit or not, but I have often suspected this of my great-grandfather because he changed our family name (from Abrahamsen to Holberg) when he arrived from Norway. Some say people frequently did this to help identify where they came from (Holberg Square is well known in Oslo, Norway), but I've always wondered...
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Post by Tara on Sept 16, 2005 7:36:02 GMT -5
I never had that suspicion. I really believed that people tried to fit in. I can see how it is difficult for a lot of people, even today. A friend of mine's grandfather changed his name too... but I really don't think everyone who changed their name deserve suspicion.
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Post by dianaholberg on Sept 16, 2005 9:04:43 GMT -5
You're right, Tara... obviously it is not this alone that makes me suspicious.
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Post by Mestemia on Sept 16, 2005 9:15:39 GMT -5
I have heard this theory many a times, but have never had anyone back it up with anythig more than so-and-so told me...
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Post by dianaholberg on Sept 16, 2005 9:26:07 GMT -5
Common sense, though, says that "normal" people would not, in general, leave a comfortable home for the less-than-hospitable environment that the emerging "New World" offered. So it's a pretty safe bet that a lot of these were folks had a reason to escape the "Old World"... whether it be escaping persecution (due to status or religion) or fear of prosecution...
Of course, there were some just looking for adventure, I'm sure. I think a great many came just hoping to become rich. Land was scarce in Europe, obtained only by inheritance. The New World offered the opportunity to eventually become landowners to folks who never had a hope of that before. Those willing to brave the elements and the natives probably saw it as the opportunity of a lifetime.
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Post by PhantomsPandora on Sept 16, 2005 14:22:18 GMT -5
I think at one time it might have been used like that, especially when it was just the colonies and they needed men to start building..
It wouldn't surprise me. Didn't they use Australia like that too or am I mistaken?
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Post by Tara on Sept 16, 2005 14:38:47 GMT -5
Never heard of Austrailia having a similar scenario.
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Post by dianaholberg on Sept 16, 2005 19:17:25 GMT -5
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Post by littlepea on Sept 16, 2005 20:32:10 GMT -5
australia was a penal colony of the british empire. basically convicts were sent to the other side of the world and left to their own devices in this strange, lawless land. i imagine it would have been complete anarchy out there with all these lunatics running around with no laws to hold them back but i don't actually know much about it. i also think i heard somewhere that australia was used to ship english convicts to while new zealand was used for scottish convicts - that's why new zealanders often have scottish surnames these days. dunno if that last bit is true or not but australia was defintely used as a penal colony of the british empire. i'm not sure if america was used as a penal colony, i think it was just advertised around europe as the place to go if you wanted to start a new life for whatever reason. it's likely that the sort of people this appealed to included criminals on the run from the law, but i imagine it also included people who were otherwise unhappy with their home life (perhaps people went across out of pure curiousity). canada was also used by the english as a place to ship the scots to with another of their attempted genocides .... i'm talking about the highland clearances, by the way
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Post by littlepea on Sept 16, 2005 20:35:26 GMT -5
in fact, here is a short and sweet answer to the question it mentions that america was used as a place to ship certain convicts to as cheap labour before immigration labour became available. so there you go.
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Post by Tara on Sept 17, 2005 7:33:20 GMT -5
America has always been about cheap labor huh? lol
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Post by PhantomsPandora on Sept 17, 2005 18:44:46 GMT -5
I'd laugh if that weren't so damn true .
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Post by cenk on Nov 24, 2005 19:40:05 GMT -5
Its simple. "America Became" what it is today because of the G word. That G word is called Genocide. You see before the White-Indo-European-Aryan-Caucasian decided to Colonize this continent there was a slight problem. The problem was that there were to the shock of the Aryans "Native Americans" that inhabited these lands. The Aryans decided that they had to kill of the original inhabitants of the land, so they did. Just like the Aryan did to the Jews, just like the Aryan did the blacks in Africa before them. I'm trying to think who the hell did the Aryan NOT KILL.
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Post by littlepea on Nov 24, 2005 22:03:54 GMT -5
logically then, the only solution is to kill all aryans, right?
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