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Post by teancum79 on Feb 28, 2006 13:36:44 GMT -5
The US is rich no two ways about it.
I think though that if the rest of the world does not want us "helping out" then we should not. We have more than enough problems close to home to make use of all our resources. We could to to Mexico and invest the same time and money in their nation that we are spending in Iraq or or Africa and other places. We could help them build a stable economy, strengthen our national ties, reduce drug trafficking and illegal immigration. That would be much more to our benefit then protecting Taiwan or Japan from China. If we are not welcome by those we protect (not those we are fighting) then we should leave and take care of ourselves.
Personally I'd prefer the US to help support education health care and peace in all over the world, but we can't hand them on a silver platter what our ancestors bled and died for both on the battle field and in the factory.
I'm not saying we have all the answers or that American culture or morels are all that great, but we do have the means to help some of the world out of poverty and free them from oppressive tyrants. However if our help is not wanted we should not force it on others.
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jedivelariuskenobi
Guide
All life is one energy, therefore, there is no i only we, and compassion then must follow
Posts: 252
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Post by jedivelariuskenobi on Feb 28, 2006 13:39:11 GMT -5
It seems that your view is that America should be liked an appreciated for protecting people and working for peace. Since when was it that people should do right only when there is adulation in store? peace to all, Jedi Velarius Kenobi
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Post by teancum79 on Feb 28, 2006 13:56:38 GMT -5
I'm not saying we should stop doing right. I am saying that if we help those who want our help things would go better.
If we devoted a set amount of resources to help build up a nation and put nations that wanted help into a line up. We would have locals helping us in their spare time rather than fighting us. This would make the process more efficient and enable us to help more people.
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Post by littlepea on Feb 28, 2006 16:35:41 GMT -5
Oh? I thought this was meant to be a thread about why people hate America. If you look at the images you can see some of the reasons about why people might hate America. you could have made a more effective case by posting fewer pictures and perhaps posting links to others if necessary. you listed so many that i only looked at one or two and then skipped the rest, that's all i'm saying. get a life what did i say that you presume to be baseless? and, by the way, it can't be slander if it's the truth. obesity is disgusting yet America doesn't seem to think so. i was just saying that the typical american (i guess it really is the sterotypical american that i'm talking about) is a very unappealing character. yeah, the rich get richer and the poor are left to rot. a lot of american society is designed to favour the rich, private healthcare being the most notable example. but this is entirely intentional tax cuts are given to the richest - WHAT'S THE POINT IN THAT? I see no reason to turn this thread into yet anothet idiot fest. my thoughts exactly
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Post by Mestemia on Feb 28, 2006 21:32:45 GMT -5
I'm not saying we should stop doing right. I am saying that if we help those who want our help things would go better. If we devoted a set amount of resources to help build up a nation and put nations that wanted help into a line up. We would have locals helping us in their spare time rather than fighting us. This would make the process more efficient and enable us to help more people. The history of Vietnam tends to show differently. Since the South Vietnamese did in fact ask for US Aid. What ticks me off is that the schools in the USA have this really neat way of forgetting about Vietnam. All through my school years I heard nothing but the barest mention of Vietnam. I had to do my own research after my father, who was there, told me a few things that I thought he was making up. Like the fact that the USA was paying the Vietcong to not attack supply trucks along a certain stretch of road.
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Post by teancum79 on Feb 28, 2006 21:49:02 GMT -5
War denial is not uncommon. I've spoken to people from other nations and WWII is not in the text books in Japan and Hitler is not a popular subject in Germany. I'm not saying it is right, but the US is not alone in selective history.
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Post by littlepea on Mar 1, 2006 8:45:41 GMT -5
if other countries are doing wrong, does that make it ok for you to do wrong?
just a thought.
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Post by Mestemia on Mar 1, 2006 11:54:54 GMT -5
it is no more wrong for the USA to do it than it is for any other country.
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Post by teancum79 on Mar 1, 2006 12:49:10 GMT -5
I never said it was, but if the US is committing the same "sin" that most other nations are why would we be singled out and attacked for it?
If we where alone in the offense than fine our bad, but we are not so we should not be treated as though we are.
Side note I personally think the selective history is a very bad plan and destructive to our society.
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Post by cenk on Mar 1, 2006 14:48:45 GMT -5
I had to do my own research after my father, who was there, told me a few things that I thought he was making up. Like the fact that the USA was paying the Vietcong to not attack supply trucks along a certain stretch of road. Interesting can you tell us as much as you know about what the U.S government conveniently "forgets" to tell us. What we dont learn in school?
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Post by teancum79 on Mar 1, 2006 15:04:47 GMT -5
Well I don't know tons in this area, but I believe that any and all references to religion are being down played or removed from the schools.
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Post by cenk on Mar 1, 2006 15:12:11 GMT -5
The US is rich no two ways about it. I think though that if the rest of the world does not want us "helping out" then we should not. We have more than enough problems close to home to make use of all our resources. We could to to Mexico and invest the same time and money in their nation that we are spending in Iraq or or Africa and other places. We could help them build a stable economy, strengthen our national ties, reduce drug trafficking and illegal immigration. That would be much more to our benefit then protecting Taiwan or Japan from China. If we are not welcome by those we protect (not those we are fighting) then we should leave and take care of ourselves. Theres helping out in the sense that the USA can fund projects in poor nations that should be administered by Americans to prevent corruption and misuse of funds. The 100's of billions of dollars the US spent on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars could have relied the debt of the poorest nations. Billions could have been invested in prevention and trying to find a cure for aids. The USA could have invested in sanitation projects in the nations that cant even afford to create sanitation systems. The USA could have created wells and other means for accessing water. I cant remember which country it was but right now people are dying from walking 50 miles to the nearest clean water supply. Many slums in the USA could have been cleared out. Billions could have been invested in the USA but it didn't happen. Then theres helping in the sense that the USA supported Saddam Hussein then they changed their minds then they imposed sanctions which directly lead to the deaths of over a million civilians (most of whom where children) then invaded Iraq and cant keep control of it. They cant prevent terrorist attacks, they cant protect civilians and they abuse prisioners. The USA is commited to fight a war on terror but it appears they dont know what they are doing - it appears they dont know how to fight a war on terror. Noam Chomsky said something on the lines of "Wanton killing of innocent civilians is terrorism, not a war against terrorism." All I have to say about the war on terror (which I partially support) is that the USA should have planned it in detail and in advance before they ran in all guns blazing.
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Post by cenk on Mar 1, 2006 15:17:19 GMT -5
Well I don't know tons in this area, but I believe that any and all references to religion are being down played or removed from the schools. I seem to remember that we were made to sing Christian songs at school quite often. I also remember we went into detail about Christianity - we had to read the bible. But for the other religions there was comparatively little to learn. If school time is spent teaching art, religion, philosophy, etc... Then its no wonder why the west is going to lose out to China and India in maths and science. Not that I'm saying its bad to learn those subjects its just that these subjects aren't going to help us and our economies in the future!
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Post by teancum79 on Mar 1, 2006 16:14:25 GMT -5
Well given the recent rulings on intelligent design. I think the only religion or morels that will be taught in public schools for many years as Atheism. A lack more morels not science is what will kill the west.
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jedivelariuskenobi
Guide
All life is one energy, therefore, there is no i only we, and compassion then must follow
Posts: 252
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Post by jedivelariuskenobi on Mar 1, 2006 16:38:19 GMT -5
intelligent design isn't morality, inteligent design is just bad science, and even worse religion. It is a corruption of each and will only serve to degrade both. I'm glad it was kept out of science classes.
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